Ivanti's Analysis of the Gartner MQ for ITSM Tools
September 12, 2019
Ian Aitchison | Director, Product Management | Ivanti
Kevin J. Smith | Senior Vice President | Ivanti
David Martinez | Sr. Product Marketing Manager | Ivanti
Alan Taylor | Principle Product Manager | Ivanti
Melanie Karunaratne | Senior Manager, Product Marketing | Ivanti
Duane Newman | Vice President, Product Management | Ivanti
What should you look for in an IT Service Management vendor? What does Gartner say about the ITSM market? It's all in the new 2019 Gartner's Magic Quadrant for ITSM Tools report. Join our panel of ITSM experts as they dive deeper into Gartner's analysis, and also share their observations on ongoing trends and predictions for future developments in service management. We'll also discuss the Critical Capabilities report. All registrants will receive a download of the report, compliments of Ivanti.
David Martinez: I'm Dave Martinez, I'm part of the product marketing team here in Ivanti and I have the distinct pleasure of being with an esteemed panel, joining me today to talk about the Gartner Magic Quadrant for IT Service Management Tools. I'll ask our team to invite us ... Excuse me, I'll ask our team to introduce themselves shortly. But before we get started with our Webinar, a little bit of housekeeping items.
David Martinez: Everybody is on mute right now, so if you have any questions go ahead and enter into the Q&A chat window or to the chat window or the Q&A window and we'll answer the questions we go through it or at the end there.
David Martinez: If you do have some audio problems downing in, try the phone. We've had some problems with WebEx where people try to come in. Sometimes they have trouble connecting through the computer, so try the phone, that usually helps out and PD the phone number you'll see it on the chat window coming up right now. The session is being recorded so you will get a link with the recording and a copy of the slides we're using as well as the link to the magic quadrant report.
David Martinez: Look for that coming out later today as part of our thank you for joining us in the webinar. We're on Twitter so you can see our Hash tag #Ivantiwebinars, please follow us on that and a please follow Kevin J. Smith, one of our panelists on his Twitter feed as well. Okay with that, let me just get into a quick agenda. We're going to be doing into before I ask our panelists to introduce themselves. Again, we're going to start off with an overview of the Magic Quadrant itself from Gartner's one of the three eminently ports in the IT space in general and specifically for the IT service management marketplace. We're going to have our panelist jump in and say their view, the magic quadrant results, how they suggest you take a look at it and also some considerations to think about as you're looking at new IT service management tools that may not be called out in the magic quadrant report or the company reports, the critical capabilities report.
David Martinez: Kind of broadly the discussion point out there and then my favorite part of these sessions, and I do want to remind our panelist that we're being recorded, so I may hold your feet to the fire on predictions. What's coming down the road in terms of the analysis from Gartner as well as things to look out for in the marketplace in general.
David Martinez: Again, we'll have questions coming out throughout the day ... Excuse me, throughout the session. Please feel free to suggest them in there and we'll get to them as we go through the session or as we get to the end. Okay, with that, let me ask our panelists to introduce themselves. Ladies first, Melanie, if I could ask you to introduce yourself, that'd be great.
Mel Karunaratne: Melanie, I'm the product marketing director for Ivanti.
David Martinez: Great, thank you so much. And Alan, if I could ask you to introduce yourself.
Alan Taylor: Yes, this is Alan Taylor and I am the Principal Product Manager for Ivanti, Service Manager and Voice Solutions.
David Martinez: Okay, perfect. Ian may I ask you?
Ian Aitchison: Yeah. Ian is a Senior Product Director here at Ivanti.
David Martinez: Okay, fantastic. We're trying to get one of our panelists still planning to join us here. Kevin, are you on the line yet?
Kevin J Smith: Yeah, hi Dave, can you hear me?
David Martinez: Hey, how are you Kevin? Glad you could join us.
Kevin J Smith: Just in time, yeah, the adventures of WebEx. Hi everybody thanks for joining us. I'm Kevin Smith, the Senior VP with Ivanti and had been following this wonderful thing, the magic quadrant that we're going to talk about today for over a decade now. So looking forward to talking about it some more.
David Martinez: Okay. Great, thank you so much everyone. Let me start us off by just doing a quick roundabout of what the magic quadrant is and my apologies for viewers who are already are very familiar with the magic quadrant, but for people who are not familiar, it's Gartner's key tool that they use to evaluate vendors in the marketplace. It looks at their overall viability and their competitive position in the marketplace itself, a little bit on the tool side that analysis on the tool itself is really more covered in the critical capabilities report.
David Martinez: But it's one of these, scan of one report, ask what's going on in the marketplace, how vendors are doing and this is the report. You can see what they look at their two by two matrices in terms of one access and the ability to execute and the other access to a completing the submission and the waiting to give on all these.
David Martinez: All of this is spelled out in more detail in the report itself, which again, you're going to get a complimentary copy after this webinar but again, it's a very comprehensive report and I know with Alan and Melanie, Kevin [inaudible 00:06:45] they really put us through our paces as the vendor to make sure that we crossed the Ts and dot the Is when they look at what really are we offering and how we work with our clients, our customers, and what our position is in the marketplace.
David Martinez: Here's the image for the magic quadrant for 2019 so as you can see, Gartner this year is focusing on 10 vendors other than over 400 in the marketplace. I'm proud to say that Ivanti is continuing its progress, improving its position in the magic quadrant. I think that's been a run for about six years now, Alan, correct me if I'm wrong. I think if I go back to 2013 with the core product, that's Ivanti Service Manager we've steadily been improving our position in the magic quadrant in 2019 to the case as well.
David Martinez: We're listed as one of the top four vendors out there, but there are a lot of other vendors out there and again, we'd like to suggest you take a look at the report and see what's out there. Bear in mind though, this is a general analysis so it's not going to be the same answer "the right answer" depending on your geography, depending on your specialty, depending on your industry for example. But in total this is not a bad report to look at to really get their mind around things.
David Martinez: You start looking at who you should start looking at when you start thinking about new IT service management tools. Not a bad result for us out there. Okay, enough of that, the people here are listening to our panelist give their thoughts about the report itself. With that we're going to go around the horn. Kevin, I'm so excited too that you were able to join us finally. We had a little bit of nervousness there, but I'm glad you're on there.
David Martinez: With that, let me ask you first, what are your initial impressions on the Magic Quality Report for service management?
Kevin J Smith: Well, Dave, I think it's always a helpful reference for people in IT and certainly people in ITSM. I think more because there's more visibility and of service management across the IT organization there's growing interest and what's happening in the service management marketplace across all of IT. I had two initial thoughts when I saw the magic quadrant. One was, there was no big surprise. There was no dramatic shift, no dramatic movement in the quadrant, no new trend emerged.
Kevin J Smith: A lot of the quadrant was very consistent with what we've seen in recent years. However, I balance that with, I was hoping to see, I guess at this point it's more of hope, hoping to see a little more critical research and critical insight from Gartner on the changes that are happening in service management.
Kevin J Smith: I think in looking at the magic quadrant we tend to focus on the graphic itself and the 10 dots on the quadrant, but a lot of the value in the quadrant is in the critical capabilities analysis. That's about 30 pages, which I think is more useful research. It's helpful research that covers areas like digital workplace incident, problem change in release configuration and a number of other areas.
Kevin J Smith: I'd really like to see in the future encourage Gartner to go into more depth in some of those areas and talk more about what's going to happen in IT in the next one to two years. I think the initial impressions are very useful, it reflects the continued evolution of ITSM. There was a new vendor on the quadrant this year, which is [inaudible 00:10:43] think is always interesting Freshworks I believe joined the quadrant this year.
Kevin J Smith: Getting more vendors into discussion is a good thing but hopefully in the years ahead as IT and ITFM are changing so much, we'd would love to see more forward looking versus a snapshot. It's very much a snapshot as of today, but I think we'd all benefit from seeing a forward looking view on what to expect and what's going to change and what service management professionals should be doing to get ready for 2020 in 2021.
David Martinez: Okay, great thank you. And you're right, the critical capabilities is the companion report that goes right into the tools themselves. One thing I want to mention to our attendees right here either live or on the recording is if you'd like a copy of the critical capabilities report, we're working on getting distribution rights for that. Please follow up with us and if you want to get a copy of the report, we'd be happy to share that with you and have a discussion around that as well.
David Martinez: Thank you Kevin on that and yes, I agree with you. It'd be nice to cover some of these emerging topics in more detail, which I think you do do in your book or books I should say. Isn't that right?
Kevin J Smith: It's an important topic. I try to Dave and I think it's also something that we do as a team here. The team that's representative and is called Ivanti is addressing the needs of service management teams today. But also we all need to be preparing for what we're going to be called on to do in the future. There's this element of strategy that's really important and service management and also what you should expect any listeners today, you should expect from a service management application and a service management solution, because so much is going to happen.
Kevin J Smith: Instead of just talking to them anecdotally for example, automation. Automation and AI are really exciting areas and they're just really lightly touched on in the MQ. I think the AI, ITSM element is just a very small component of the critical capabilities and it's certainly going to be, if not the most important thing, on a very, very short list of the most important things in service management over the next 24 months.
David Martinez: Now, I think you're right. ITSM again is using AI technologies to really augment their ideas and processes. I agree, that's an exciting place to look at. Thank you, Kevin. Moving on, Melanie, let me ask you, what were your initial thoughts and impressions on the MQ and also the critical capabilities if you want to expand the discussion?
Mel Karunaratne: With the NQ, I agree with Kevin. They weren't any great surprises. It was good news but if [inaudible 00:13:29] we can see that the market is still strong, it's not so stagnating, vendors are still continuing to innovate towards market needs but no big surprises. One vendor sneaker as a niche player, I think that's a healthy thing. It gives customers options depending on their requirements.
Mel Karunaratne: It is interesting to note when you see it and go out and have comments that when you look across the vendors that are positioned, how many have been a party to acquisitions and mergers. They've gotten to helpfully provide the guide where product names have changed and which can be confusing for organizations. But, the report itself, I don't know highlights where vendor solutions are too complex or they need changes in pricing policy and again those things are good to call out.
Mel Karunaratne: They also talk about market size, which is something that we also agree with, it's not just about market size as the way to determine tools, the size of spend vendor share. It's about the maturity of the organization that is looking for tools. I agree that there is a correlation there and we have seen even in our own ranks some very mature organization, they were smaller but performing well. But you do need to have the support and structure in place to maintain those tools. There is still a need for us, size as well as maturity there.
David Martinez: That's a good point, yes. It was interesting I think if I remember the size, yeah, from 2010 to 2019 Gartner estimates the market for IT essentials more than doubles. It's fairly mature market and stable as you guys mentioned, the fact that it's grown over twice in that time period it's actually pretty amazing to me. Good, thank you.
Mel Karunaratne: Yeah, it is.
David Martinez: Yeah.
Mel Karunaratne: I think when Gartner talks about the vendors, they talk about the fact that vendors are targeting organizations by market size as well and they shouldn't be, and they should be targeting by maturity. But I think there's a balance there. As I said, we do know organizations that are smaller and have mature processes, but you do need that structure in place, as I said. I don't think you can be able ... A really small organization that has some of these tools in place. This is the enterprise level quadrant. I think there's another quadrant, a service desk quadrant which covers the smaller organization needs.
David Martinez: Now, that's a good point, thank you Melanie for that. Ian let me turn to you now. Your thoughts?
Ian Aitchison: Yeah, lots of thoughts actually. It's interesting listening to those points. I'm just scribbling down loads of ideas here on a piece of paper. One of them I think is to remind everybody, and I think you mentioned it earlier, you said, you have remind everybody looking at a magic quadrant report. Remember this is really an assessment of the vendor as a whole. They do take into account the capability of the tools, but they also consider that organization's ability to deliver value to their customers on a wide scale.
Ian Aitchison: And leaving comments in the report around selecting a vendor that can work with you for at least five years, invest in service management, prioritize skills, training process and proper product implementation. That's an important point because with service management you are all having an ongoing relationship with a technology vendor, possibly a partner working with them and expertise and experience in that area.
Ian Aitchison: Because another point I was going to make is service management is blossoming. It's blooming, it's taking over the world, he says rather elaborately. Maybe not quite to that level, but the principles in service management, effort in through from self-service, to work flow to queue management, to shift left. All of these concepts are becoming more and more common. When we have conversations around service management, it's no longer around just incident problem change with release request CMDB, it's the wider picture because service management is part of the wider picture.
Ian Aitchison: That's why I think somewhere in there there's a reference in the report to integration with broader item tools is key they say. Integration with broader items tools is key because service management cannot be service management alone, it's too important. It's fundamentally connected to so many other parts of an organization's ability to do business.
Ian Aitchison: The fact there isn't much movement on the reports, does that really matter? I mean, all that indicates is, as they say in the report, it's a mature market, right? There's lots of great capabilities that the nine vendors that are identified as standing out at nine, 10, nine, those above the horizontal line, they only make small moves, year on year typically.
Ian Aitchison: Those are the bottom left hand corner, that's the lobby right when they come in and they move around a bit and they bounce around a bit and it's a hard fight to get up above that line. Some do, some don't stay in there and some exit and we see that over the years. It'd be great to do an animation over many years of this report. As Gartner and will tell their clients too and tell us vendors too, this is just one view of the market and a client should select the organization that's right for them.
Ian Aitchison: Nobody should use this as a definitive identifier of the right solution. But it does help everybody by identifying the shortlist and helping guide to the right people to talk to to make those discovery points. In summary, I think it's a pretty decent report this year, no dramatic changes, but there's nothing wrong with that. That's not a bad sign.
David Martinez: Great, no, thank you Ian. That's good points in there. Alan you've been patiently waiting here to get your thoughts out. Do you mind if I ask you to share them?
Alan Taylor: Yeah, last in line there's a lot of great information that's been said already, but when I think about my initial impressions on the quadrant is as you look at it all and really read into it beyond the graphic, whether it's the strengths or the cautions, there was nothing that really stood out to me. I was like yeah, yeah, I knew that. To Kevin's point, it would be good to look forward.
Alan Taylor: What kind of this would be more forward thinking, looking on in the future? It is a good overall of the current state of things but my initial thought was, yes, no surprise, not much movement being on this side of things and being involved, a new Ivanti would move up. It will certainly ... Why would that movement be, in relation to the rest of the market? And I guess I was a little bit surprised to not see anything ... No, really movement.
Alan Taylor: I talked to a lot of customers and were talking about a lot of innovative ideas and I didn't necessarily see that reflected in some of these things so, we'll see. Always good to have good vendors as previously mentioned, get some new things. It'll be interesting to see where this evolves. But those are just my initial thoughts.
David Martinez: Okay, no, that's great, thank you so much Alan. I'm going to ask you maybe later on to list some other things you'd like to see in the magic quadrants covered later on some of those capabilities, but hold that thought. Kevin, let me come back to you. Alan said there weren't many surprises to report for him. You mentioned automation, you thought it should've been called out more. Anything else surprised you in there?
Kevin J Smith: I guess David, I was surprised that there was not more specific examples cited of how AI and automation and machine learning can be leveraged within service management. I mentioned, I went through the critical capabilities and again I would encourage everybody to just take, it doesn't take very long, but just take 10 or 15 minutes and go through their critical capabilities descriptions because there's about a dozen of them and it's just good content.
Kevin J Smith: It's good. It's educational content for any of us that are in service management and just we really need to remain students of this market because as Ian said, and I think a couple of others have commented, this is a blossoming segment of the IT organization. This is a segment of the IT organization that's more and more strategic. I think most of you on the call, most of our listeners would be nodding their head in agreement with that because service management is providing so much influence over what's happening across all of IT and don't get caught.
Kevin J Smith: This is something that all of us need to remember is don't get caught up in the emotional element of glancing at the quadrant since that's the focus of our call today. Don't just glance at the quadrant and then leave it at that. The research that's being done here does offer a little more depth, I'd like to see much more depth because ITFM is becoming more strategic. I think it merits more investment from the Gartner analyst. I'd love to see more original research and EMT report versus just the quadrant itself.
Kevin J Smith: I understand that it's generated by an algorithm as Gartner would continually remind us based on all the numerical data they've collected and then the conversations they've had with clients. I'd like to see more original research published uniquely in the MQ report. That is more forward looking, that's more aggressive, that is more speculative. I do appreciate that Gardner tries to steer away from that because they get a lot of heat when clients or readers don't like what they're saying, but I think we need that.
Kevin J Smith: I really think we need a little more controversy. We need a little more excitement. We need more insight in the market and in the MQ and we need to see the MQ become a must read piece of research for anybody in service management and anybody in IT. Now, my last comment will be that there are a few research pieces that are cited in the report, they're referenced in there. And it's not a long list. I think it's six or seven, approximately a couple of those are really good pieces.
Kevin J Smith: Along the lines of continuing our education and continuing to learn in this market and getting ready for what the next five years of service management holds for us, which I think is going to be very exciting, some of extensions of research are useful references as well that do go into some more depth of what we can expect in some of the related areas and some of the items and the critical capabilities that are referenced at a very high level or in passing are explored in more depth than some of the additional research that Gartner is doing.
David Martinez: Now, that makes sense. Thank you. Thank you for that Kevin. Let me just finish around the horns here. Melanie, any surprises that came out of the report for you? Additional surprises?
Mel Karunaratne: No, I was going to say, I said at the beginning, I don't see any great surprises, I would've liked more movement. I don't disagree with the rest of the panel in terms of what we expect to see on this but the MQ is the MQ, it's been produced under a certain set of guidelines and there are lots of organizations out there that are looking for the information that's in there. They are looking for those three or four pieces of information per vendor and then Gartner produces a bunch of other reports that cover the innovative side and the forward looking piece.
Mel Karunaratne: That said, maybe all of the Gartner MQs because obviously this is only one of several ones that we are in, that they need to reevaluate what the objective of the MQ is and maybe do some research with their own clients to see if what they're providing is what's needed. But it's still a good read, but still some really interesting information depending on what your objectives are. Again, that's a good point. Everyone has different objectives, everyone must look at the MQ from their own lens, not just as a one size fits all. You really cannot do that.
Mel Karunaratne: I'd also challenge the idea that we should be ... IT organizations that they should be looking across MQs because again, Gartner changes the waiting and this is something I think everyone needs to stay ahead of. The waiting of some of the scoring, not every year, but it does change so that each report can't necessarily be compared against the year before.
Mel Karunaratne: I'd say there's necessarily any surprises, it would be nice to see more information about that particular vendors maybe asked about the product because that is [inaudible 00:28:07] critical capabilities but more about the viability of the organization because that's what the MQ is about, how they're executing. I'd like to see more of that.
David Martinez: Yeah, that's great. Ian, I know nothing surprises you, but if you had a one or two surprises that came out of that, that'd be great. Then if I could ask you also to kick us off as you start talking a little bit more you've done it already, to start talking a little bit more, how your IT professionals should be looking at the MQ. For example, you said earlier that don't look at as an identifier of the "right vendor" but as piece of research to factor in. Do you mind taking it from there?
Ian Aitchison: Yeah, absolutely. I'm looking at [inaudible 00:28:56] it Kevin too. I think that the magic quadrant is a defined thing. What it delivers is almost like a predefined objective. It lays out who are the leading vendors in the market. It gives them three prices, three criticisms. They can only have three good things, three bad things, and it lays them out in a comparative position and Melanie is right, you can't compare year on year except everybody does, but you can't really, what you can compare obviously is relative position.
Ian Aitchison: However, position compared to others which vendors moved in a positive way, which comprises a vendors move in a negative way year on year compared to each other because they're all being assessed in the same way year on year. But you can't say, from one year to another to another. It's a consistent measure, Gartner are very clear on that. But generally I'm still pretty cool with what the quadrant is.
Ian Aitchison: I think it serves a very good purpose. It helps organizations identify maybe the organization they're working with, their vendor, their tool sets, is that one which is recognized, is clearly investing, is growing, takes the market seriously, takes the industry seriously, it's going to be around for those five years they mentioned. That's important if your vendor does not on that reason for concern. If your vendor in that diagram is shifting year on year closer and closer to the back of the pack while the rest of the pack is moving forward that would indicate maybe that that vendor doesn't have it's eye really focused on that market and it's your business getting value from that technology as well.
Ian Aitchison: It's interesting the way it's like difficult. Maybe it's interesting the way that many years ago the leaders in the magic quadrant report was the big mega platform on premises vendors that the CA's the HP, the IBMs and as time has gone by those big mega platform organizations are the ones which are gradually thinking towards that bottom left of the pack. Obviously there's a big mega platform vendor. Maybe the next breed at the top but then of course you have the classic innovator's dilemma, where it's difficult to retain that with new organizations come in with innovation.
Ian Aitchison: It's interesting I think watching these things move around. Again, how to view it if it says, these are the organizations that take the market seriously. These are the organizations you should talk to and understand which are the right ones for you. If your vendor is not aware, maybe you should talk to your vendor about why they're not and reassure yourself that everything is okay there because it's a long relationship.
David Martinez: Now, that's a good point and let me key off on the point you made there about, you have to make sure it's right for you and Melanie I'm going to pivot to you on this one because you brought up the point earlier that, one size doesn't fit all. Organizations you need to look at the maturity and their size to determine what's going to be a set of tools they should look at. Do you mind elaborating on that a bit more? Because I think that's an important point.
Mel Karunaratne: Sure. I mean, the MQ and the critical capabilities provide a trusted source of their passive evaluation. That doesn't mean that, as I said you can't look at it just through the lens of Gartner, you've got to look at it as the requirements that you have and your list of things. How they relate to the vendors or the information that's provided by Gartner MQ. Quite honestly, you do need to have the critical capabilities to handle as well because you need to look across both.
Mel Karunaratne: You need to look at the vendor viability. Is that vendor doing the right things from a sales and marketing perspective? Do they have the right road maps in place for you? You need to be connecting to those vendors to understand some of those things. You're not going to get all of that from the critical case capabilities report. A lot of [inaudible 00:33:25].
David Martinez: Sorry Melanie, you do need the critical capabilities in that view. You need a combination of the dimension Quadrants and-
Mel Karunaratne: Exactly what I've just said. The MQ only gives you the vendor viability. You need the critical capabilities report for the product piece of it ... You can't leave it. I don't think if you're using Gartner as your analyst trusted source that you should just be looking at one piece because then the viability or their sales and marketing doesn't necessarily pay to the organization.
Mel Karunaratne: Yes I'm of a maturity level of the silk and therefore these vendors on the MQ are going to fit me. You need to look at the critical capabilities as well, so you get insights about vendors and their portfolios integrations and a lot more depth in the critical capabilities. It's largely known as the MQ, it's just an evaluation of the vendor rather than the solution itself. That's why you need those critical capabilities, so combining the two I think it's really important.
Mel Karunaratne: The other thing I would say about these reports to remember is that it's a snapshot in time. It's the state of play at the point where those vendors they are on the report were asked to submit. Generally that's around the March, [inaudible 00:34:49] call it timeframe. It's like what-
David Martinez: April 1st?
Mel Karunaratne: April, that's right. Thank you Dave, the way these reports are being published now, August time, I don't think that what you're reading now is the vendor's full capability. Because there are certain criteria that state such, that products have to be in play, they have to be released, they have to be out in the market in order for that information to be submitted and that's where those vendors were in March.
Mel Karunaratne: Of course most vendors leave only their continually releasing features at the moment. Including ourselves, we're continuing to innovating to meet challenges that service management organizations are facing across IT and the wider business. If you as an organization aren't necessarily seeing the information that you need, that matches your requirements on the report the moment, you should reach out to those vendors and ask what they're doing now and what their road maps are, match their specific requirements.
David Martinez: Now that's a good point. In fact, I remember the April 1st date because there was a April fool's day here in North American's app, tell me a little tongue and cheek fun making that date there.
Kevin J Smith: Hey Dave, I just wanted to make one comment. It's Kevin and there was another dimension as I was listening to Melanie talk through that, that I was reminded in looking at the report that there's also an evaluation of basic, intermediate and advanced an organization falling into one of those categories. Then there's a numerical scoring from where the vendors are ranked and each of those areas in those three categories, basic, intermediate and advanced.
Kevin J Smith: It's interesting because the vendor mix is very different as you go through those three categories. That could be another helpful reference, another helpful tool inside the Quadrant that an organization could use. It also requires them to be objective about where they currently are and where they expect to be in the future. That could be a good index to help guide them to what solutions could be the best possible fit.
David Martinez: Oh, so you're saying this is a tool that a client can use, organization can use to figure out where they are in terms of maturity from a basic, intermediate or advanced level, and then you've got to look at the different tool set because based on their immediate requirements?
Kevin J Smith: Well, what it does is in the MQ it ranks the participants in the MQ and each of those three categories and scores them in terms of capabilities as it is a fit for a basic organization, basic requirements, intermediate and advanced. The vendors change the ranking of the vendor's changes through each of the three categories depending on the requirements and what Gartner's evaluation as are the requirements for basic service management capabilities and maturity versus intermediate person's advanced.
David Martinez: Yeah, now that's great. This goes back to your point Melanie, about one size doesn't fit all of the nice picture in the MQ and Kevin, your point, that's what you gravitate to, with the nice picture but Melanie your point that you really need as an organization to figure out where you are on the maturity level and your size and that could definitely influence the tool you look at. Great point, did you want to elaborate on that a little bit or you've already said it?
Kevin J Smith: Well, I think what's implied, and I don't know if you're referring to Melanie or myself, but if not me, Melanie can comment.
David Martinez: I'm sorry.
Kevin J Smith: I think what's implying-
David Martinez: I'm talking to Melanie.
Kevin J Smith: ... This is-
David Martinez: It's okay Kevin.
Kevin J Smith: ... Yeah, it's just being self critical, being self evaluation of what your organization needs and where it is.
David Martinez: Melanie, I'm sorry I wasn't clear on the question but if you want to talk more about the maturity but I keep coming back. That's a key point that's spelled out. Definitely a critical capabilities report.
Mel Karunaratne: Yes, that's all, I think you've said it all. You need to look at both reports based on your level of maturity and the level of maturity of the vendor and make sure that you've got the fits between you. One of the things I wanted to bring up which I don't think anyone has mentioned yet. One thing that Gartner are using more and more are the Gartner peer reviews and these are independent reviews by vendor customers.
Mel Karunaratne: That plays a big part these days as well as Gartner client inquiries, both of those play a part in the scoring that Gartner provides to us. It's again, not just their own information but it's what the customers are saying about vendors in their inquiry calls or on their peer reviews. Again, in those peer reviews, I think it tends to say something like a large organization, the health industry. If you are in a particular industry, you might be able to find customers in similar industries that are providing those, that part kind of information and then you can see what other people are saying as well.
David Martinez: Now that's a great point. There's a great level of information available in the peer reviews and I don't think you need to be a Gartner client to look at those. You encourage people to take a look at that. If you're looking to select a new ITSM tool or actually any IT tool, Gartner's live peer reviews have got around a bunch of them, so that's great. Kevin, I want to come back to you as the questions come in. I think it was you that brought up that the current capabilities have a lot of good content for IT professionals. They should use it as part of their ongoing education. Could you elaborate a bit more what good content we talking about?
Kevin J Smith: Well, yeah, and their critical capabilities goes through a list of categories. There's a digital workplace description, then there's an incident problem section, change in release configuration, self-service, service request, knowledge collaboration, which is an interesting one. SLA's and metrics, workflow integration, UI, the user experience, and then Dave, what you mentioned earlier, AI, ITSM.
Kevin J Smith: The interesting thing about that is that every organization is a little bit unique. Now, many organizations in service management are doing some of these things. I'm sure of two, each of our listener is aware of what they're doing in terms of their service management journey. The interesting thing is, the critical capabilities index can help people be aware, can help broaden their perspective a bit on what could be coming next.
Kevin J Smith: I think change and release is a good one because many organizations have not yet done that, but we would agree it's important to service management, and those that still have that ahead of them, it could be a helpful reference and give them some considerations and looking at ... And whether they're going to be selecting a new vendor in the future or not it can still be useful. It also helps anybody in service management to get their arms around the scope of service management today, and the processes is that Gartner is reviewing here and that other organizations are thinking about and are operating.
Kevin J Smith: I think it's just a very good reference as service management continues to evolve and helps define, this is not the only definition of the scope of service management, but it's just a good practical reference because Gartner is talking to so many companies and talking to so many clients in addition to just reviewing the companies that are represented in the Quadrant and itself.
David Martinez: Now, that's good. Let me turn to Alan. Alan, you're somebody who also talks to a lot of clients in a lot of organizations. I'm going to ask you, your suggestions for how IT professionals should look at the MQ and also just kick us off as well to start thinking about other things to consider beyond what's covered in the MQ. We've touched on a couple of different things in here and other parts of IT but let me hand it off to you. Other considerations, other things other people should be looking at. Alan are you muted?
Alan Taylor: Well, I was thinking nothing that really hasn't been said already, all right. As we look at the MQ, the critical capabilities and peer reviews, right? These are all just, they're tools, they're input, they're sources of information that current organizations look at to understand. As I'm looking out there for solutions, not only do I have to find a product that is a good fit for my requirements, but I also got to be aligned with a vendor, then it's a good fit for my organization. That partnership and the technology have got to both be considered. As it's been said, you just can't just look at the critical capabilities that says, "Oh, wow, they are [inaudible 00:01:22] in all these things, they must be great." Or, maybe not, all right. Or if you just look at the MQ like, "Oh, they're one of the top rated vendors that must be X, Y and Z."
Alan Taylor: My only caution would be as you look at these, by try not to make assumptions about what's out there, but understand these are sources of information that really will help organizations find it, not only the best product, but also the best partner. Understanding that it doesn't end once a product has been in purchased or implemented, that relationship is ongoing.
Alan Taylor: And you want a vendor that's going to do two things. One, that's going to continue to deliver innovation into their product. From maturity perspective, they can go hand in hand along with you, but also, one that's just nice. You want people who would be easy to work with, you don't want to have that type of friction during updates or upgrades or whatever it might be. Just look at these as a source of information. Don't make assumptions and understand that across the board, you're not just looking for a product, you're looking for a partner.
David Martinez: Now I like the way you said that. Yeah, you're looking for a long-term partnership ideally. I know we have a lot of turns sometimes in our client base, but ideally there's somebody who goes in for long term not just meet the requirements today, but also what you've got 18 months from now, three years from now, five years from now. There's always going to be challenges or surprises coming. Great, thank you. Ian let me come back to you because you brought up something earlier in terms of integrations. That's something that's touched on in the MQ a little bit more as the current capabilities, but you said there was something that's really important and should get more consideration. Do you want to elaborate?
Ian Aitchison: Yeah. The point I was making there was once upon a time in that you'd look at a service management solution and it's funny if you think way to show old stuff and it goes way back you'd look for a help desk product, so I need a help desk. Years and years ago and then service management grew and it became much more defined, IT defined set of processes and practices and capabilities and all these good things.
Ian Aitchison: I mean, that's great but what's very apparent is if you draw a whole mull around these technologies, if you say, "Well, my request work flow is here and my service management tool," Then I'd have to wait while somebody goes and does something in another tool and then comes back and says, "I've done it and then my work flow can move on," That's no longer good enough. Once upon a time people would have said, "Oh, yes, that's automation, I'm automating the process."
Ian Aitchison: All you're really doing is automating, putting something in somebody's queue and then you're waiting for them to get around to doing it. That elements of integration as Kevin would reference it, that automation driving two way integration between the technologies that run the business and freeing up people from the drudgery of repetitive work, enabling them to focus on high value work.
Ian Aitchison: And they're building the expensive and valuable time to be used to further automate what IT does and automate the value that's delivered to the business, that's slightly net phrase, now that's where digital transformation comes in, right? That's where you're changing the ability for people to do their job. You can do none of that without integration between your service management tool and the technologies that do.
Ian Aitchison: Service management pretty much defines what needs to be done, but it relies a lot of the time on people to do the doing. Now increasingly we see integration doing the doing and we're freeing people up to define the better way to do things in the future.
Ian Aitchison: That's an important thing and related to that also, as we look at the critical capabilities, there's the thought there as organizations are evolving through more maturity around integration and automation and tying technologies together, being able to deliver to the end point from a service request, being able to spin up and spin down virtual environments, to reboot things from incidents, that sort of thing.
Ian Aitchison: As organizations are doing that, they are evolving through their expectation of the tool. Now the critical capabilities breaks the tools down and applies use cases that's basic maturity and more advanced maturity, and I think I've got in front me very advanced maturity. A clear point, these organizations need a tool that will carry them from one level to the next to the next. If you're not at the top level, don't select the tool that's really good only at the top level.
Ian Aitchison: If you're at these lower levels of maturity and there's nothing wrong with that, completely knowing where all organizations are. If you're in a slightly lower level of maturity, don't select a tool which only good at that level of maturity because if you try and move beyond it, you're done, you're stuck. You look for a tool which ranks high across all of the ratings in the critical capabilities. Because that's a future proof and it seems like one of the pivotal things in their positioning, is all about integration, automation, and AI, ITSM great phrase, I like that one. Is very heavily connected to integration and automation as well. Yes, those are my thoughts on that.
David Martinez: Let me just pick up one point there. You mentioned about a tool that grows with you. I've heard from other clients, what they'd like to have is a tool that can grow with them, but they implement what they need when they need it, because we've heard some horror stories that do big bang implementations where they use ... Honestly I think I heard this from Gartner, less than 10% of what was implemented. Have you heard similar type of recommendations or stories?
Ian Aitchison: Yeah and it's funny actually I've seen both, but I'm sure others on this call have. I've seen organizations that have said, "We want to eat the whole elephant in one go." And have tried to do so and found it's very challenging and then everybody goes, "Well, you need to face it. You need to gradually introduce a new tool that's lets you switch on these capabilities." And that's quite right for those organizations. There are a few where they say, "You know what? We are really focused on this and we have to get going with incident and request and change in CMDB and capacity and availability really quickly. We are under commercial pressure so we're much more focused on this. We have to do this."
Ian Aitchison: And with the right tool this can be done. The tools that are not perhaps the more, the old fashioned, unfashioned style of code that employees have to write code to configure and have a very, very high overhead. It is possible for very focused organizations to move very quick. Realistically, if you look at the bell curve, the majority will get best benefit by always taking it step by step, even if it's easy to get to the next step, prove your success on the current step first. Get everybody happy with that then move to the next one if it's still the typical model and it would be with almost any IT related project, I think.
David Martinez: Just get a full foundation in place before you move forward. I think this is a sound advice, as I go back to my carpentry days, I remember that. Melanie, let me come back to you because Ian mentioned something, he goes, the better way of doing things then it's driving transformation. We start looking at ITSM tools and that's true not just for IT. I mean, we've had discussions where IT teams are helping automate things and improve the service delivery of departments outside of IT. Then they call it enterprise service management. I'm surprised ... Well, I'm not surprised Gartner doesn't cover that, but what are your thoughts on that topic?
Mel Karunaratne: Yeah, that's why and yeah, you mentioned the points, I'm surprised Gartner didn't cover that. Gartner don't read, they don't recognize enterprise service management as a market shall we say. We certainly see maybe not as a market, but the workflows and processes that our customers want to put in place are stretching beyond IT, ITSM. Every organization is different and now I can take for example our customers in the higher education market at the moment.
Mel Karunaratne: I know several industries who ... Not industries, I know several organizations who some of them are just rolling out from their ITSM journey. Then we've got others where their departments are clamoring to collaborate their workflow and automation success across departments from library services to student registration to security. They don't call it enterprise service management. It's just using those same best practices, those same workflows, so they've proven to work in ITSM in other areas of their organization. So we are seeing that for sure.
Mel Karunaratne: We have lots of customers coming to us certainly and they're doing it in steps though. We're not necessarily having someone ... The HR organization is not necessarily coming to any ITSM tool vendor and saying, "Hey, we need your ITSM tool in HR." That's not the way it tends to work, it tends to work with the IT organization showing that they're successful, that they are providing end users with a great service.
Mel Karunaratne: Those end users are then looking into other departments. Other departments are coming to IT and saying, "Well, if it's working for you guys, what are you doing? What workflows? What processes can you help us build across our business?" That's what we are seeing more and I said right to the beginning, Gartner don't recognize enterprise service management as a thing but it's certainly happening out there in the world of industry.
David Martinez: Yeah, so it's definitely something that organizations think about because it's a good way to leverage or increase your ROI, you've got to invest in a service management tool, great. Hey, we're getting close to the top of the hour, and before we get the predictions, there's one question that's come in. I don't think I've been able to cover yet and Ian I'm going to throw it to you. The question, what's preventing Ivanti from moving into the leader Quadrant? I guess as a long-term follower Ivanti, is we've been moving up and up in the challenge and Quadrant. What would you say would take us to move over the line?
Ian Aitchison: I think I'm really quite happy that our roadmap of innovation, our unified IT focus of growing success is going to keep us moving in that direction. Melanie said at some point in time when it's the first, we have some really exciting stuff that's come out since the Magic Quadrant assessment period and more really exciting stuff coming in and then run ups in the next one.
Ian Aitchison: We all would love to be blooming around the diagram with enormous philosophy. I'm very comfortable with that little scrutiny into the things, not only that we have done, but we're working on now. I think that no other organization in the market I think can do. I'm pretty sure, so I'm a little more conservative in my expectation maybe. I'm very comfortable that we're doing all the right things. She knows that means we should be at the front of the pack then we will be at the front of the pack. If it means we're second or third and it matters to some people significantly, then it is what it is. I see us as an organization clearly becoming a leader in the market and I see no change to that. We have taken in the right steps.
David Martinez: I think they stay focused on customer success.
Mel Karunaratne: I just wanted to ask.
David Martinez: Oops, sorry, go ahead.
Mel Karunaratne: I just wanted to ask, I mean, that top right quadrant is get to that top right quadrant for innovating and I think we innovate with intent. You can innovate so far but the only way to sustain that is by increasing your prices, increase by having ... Organizations have to include more professional services and so on and so forth.
Mel Karunaratne: I think you need to be careful when you're looking at some of these vendors who are innovating really soft. That's what Gartner wants, Gartner loves that. But is that right for the organizations that are trying to implement these tools or deploy these tools? And when there may be low maturity as we're seeing, or they may be, they don't necessarily want to be using lots of professional services because these innovations are so new that they need a lot of main infrastructure support underneath them.
David Martinez: Now, that's a good point. That goes back again, don't look at the picture of the Magic Quadrant. Figure out your own needs and requirements and see what vendors could be a good partner for you, thank you. Okay, we're at the top of the hour, but before we go we can have a survey intelligence just for a few seconds. I'm going to ask for a quick lightning round, 20 seconds each on what your predictions are. Either with the Magic Quadrant or in IT in general. Either IT, [inaudible 00:58:26] IT in general. Alan, I'm going to start with you if that's okay.
Alan Taylor: Yes, Magic Quadrant as Ivanti gains market share, that will continue to push us more and more into the leader's quadrant if that is very moving up into the right. From an IT service management perspective. I think we're going to see the proliferation of AI leverage in ways hadn't currently not thought of as more cognitive capability becomes available and mobility will be key.
David Martinez: I love it, thank you. Kevin, I'm going to ask for your prognostications.
Kevin J Smith: Yeah, I am going to predict that we'll see more change in the MQ in the next two to three years because service management itself is changing so fast. Ivanti has had a very steady trajectory. I wouldn't swap our trajectory for anybody else's over the past five years and I think we'll continue to make good steady progress. We'll emerge as a continued strengthening leader, of the leader that we are. I think we will see new factors, get more focus in the Magic Quadrant. Things that are going to reshape service management and how services are delivered within IT and across the business. I think it'll be a lot of fun to see that change over the next few years.
David Martinez: I like that, there's been a lot of fun. Ian, your predictions.
Ian Aitchison: In creation, automation, AI, ITSM. I think those are the three areas we will continue to see the fastest movement in the near future. I think the opportunities for service management professionals to become increasingly productivity and transformation professionals with that, their experience and background are growing. I think Ivanti's year on year progressing the market is wonderful, I think we're having a great time. It's a wonderful ride and the road is clear ahead and yeah, it should be a good time.
David Martinez: Okay, Melanie, if it closes out, do you also see a good ride coming along?
Mel Karunaratne: Absolutely, I always love a fun ride, and I think that all of the things that the other guys have said that ring true. I think from AI perspective we've seen over the last couple of years, AI popping up at events that vendors have been at and they've been a smattering of interest. Sometimes vendors have added to the IT confusion by mixing common automation with AI. What I'm now seeing is a better understanding from IT organizations themselves, like the operations organizations themselves. They're reviewing capabilities with more positive intent than general interest. I think that might [inaudible 01:01:24] on the MQ, so that there are more use cases around AI, ITSM that we're not seeing at the moment.
David Martinez: Wow, those are all exciting things to look forward to and I'm looking forward to seeing what the future comes from along in five years sooner than we all think. With that, let me just close out our session. I want to thank Kevin, Ian, Alan and Melanie for joining us. Very great discussion and I loved it, thank you and hopefully the rest of our attendees enjoyed it. Got some good comments here, thank you that they enjoyed the session.
David Martinez: I just want to remind people the session was recorded, and you will get links with the recording, the presentation and also a complimentary link to a complimentary copy of the MQ report.
David Martinez: Again, we talked about the current capabilities report. If you like that, let us know and I'd be happy to share that with you. With that again, let me extend my thanks to everybody, my palace of course, and our attendees, and I want to wish everybody a wonderful rest of the day. Thank you so much and take care all. Bye-bye.